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Visual Studio39
All,



I am thinking about doing the MCSE exams and the route I am going to take is

to buy some books and start from there. I was thinking about the MCSE

Windows 2003 Core requirements ISBN 0735619530 as a good starting point but I

notice that three out of the four books within the set are not availible for

sale seperatly any more. Does any one know why this is? Are Microsoft about

to publish revised versions?



The reason for asking is I do not wish to go out and spend £100 on the books

to find out that they are not worth it.



Does anyone have any views on these books or are there better ones out there

for the MCSE Cert?



Thanks in advance.


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ADAdmin wrote:

How much of your experience is in NT, 2000 or 2003? If you say a good

bit, I would get the skills being measured for the exam I was going to

take, buy the 2003 Resource Kit and Transenders or Self-Test exams.

Take one of the tests, see where your weaknesses were and let that be

the start of where to study.



The only thing I really like about the MS Press books are the labs and

exercises, I find that they collect dust after I finish with the exams;

where as I have referred many times to the Res Kit.



Just my 2 cents

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Congrats on your goal to get an MCSE. The cert itself doesn't give you any

skill, but it certainly will look very nice on a resume coupled with that 11

years of IT experience you've got.



The Transcender practice exams have gotten me thru 11 tests so far. Not

only do they get you prepared for the tricky questions of the exam, but they

do an excellent job of explaining the answers and referencing books if you

want to dig into an answer further.



I personally don't like book study for the exams because there's far too

much filler info that I have to skim thru. I just want the details, the

rules, the methods, etc...



"ADAdmin" wrote:

did you hear =?Utf-8?B?SmFsZXhhbmRlcjAx?=

<Jalexander01@discussions.microsoft.com>say in



I like them for just this reason. And they are not dumps. Stay away from

dumps. TestKing is a dump, Transcenders are a test prep.



(baiting chalk for yet another round of arguing <g>)



--

Neil MCNGP#30



- A good hot dog feeds the hand that bites it.

-

did you hear =?Utf-8?B?SmFsZXhhbmRlcjAx?= <Jalexander01

@discussions.microsoft.com>say in news:D58F7F7E-B2B1-4D0B-806A-

A300224488EF@microsoft.com:



I will disagree here. Cram the brain with books, CD info, Videos,

websites, TechNet, MSDN, KB articles, books online, every thing. The best

will be actually using the product and trying things out. Create a

network (consider using Virtual Machines - either VPC or VMWare) and

build and break till you really understand it.



--

Neil MCNGP#30



- If at first you don't succeed, change the rules.

-

that's right Neil they're test preps. As the format of the real exams

bare's no resemblance to the real world, why should these types of

'test preps' be any different :-)



Kline Sphere (Chalk) MCNGP #3

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absolutely.



Kline Sphere (Chalk) MCNGP #3

-

lol!



wow, they point you to the msdn/exam coarse notes.



This would be fine I've they never gave you the answer's, thus

requiring people to actual go off and so the research. As it is,

people simply 'memorize the answers' to questions which the taker

hopes will be similar (or the same) as those in the real exam. This

hardly proves an understanding of the subject matter.



Kline Sphere (Chalk) MCNGP #3

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Ebay is your friend :-)



Yup.



Kline Sphere (Chalk) MCNGP #3

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In microsoft.public.cert.exam.mcse, Kline Sphere spewed across the ether:



They do so! Ben said so.



And it's "bears"



--

JaR

Thug 10110

MCNGP.com/spelling/politzei

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did you hear Kline Sphere <.@>say in



depends on teh colour of the sky in your world. There are a ton of places

that use multiple domains, My office has one that supports 2500 users.

There are little shops that will merrily use RRAS, where as I would

rather pull off my own head. There are places that wouldn't be caught

dead using Windows DNS even if thye do have to have an AD Domain. I think

that it's ok. The exams cover a pretty broad spectrum and the real world

just might have some of those things.



As for the word "prep", are you suggesting that preparing for a test is

bad? is Learning something a bad thing? Should I blindly go into an exam

without reviewing material? I have plenty of experience, even though I

have mentioned I wouldn't be cuaght dead using RRAS; I'm sure that wont

be on the 70-216 exam. Sure I see it listed on www.microsoft.com/learning

as an area covered, but this is the real world right. oh sorry, reading

that was preparing wasn't it. DAGNUBIT! I must have been cheating when I

read that without knowing it...



--

Neil MCNGP#30



- Sex is not the answer. Sex is the question. "Yes" is the answer.

-

did you hear Kline Sphere <.@>say in



and then fill in the gaps with the Transcenders...



*poke, poke*



--

Neil MCNGP#30



- Dachshund: Half a dog high by a dog and a half long.

-

did you hear Kline Sphere <.@>say in



no they point to the exam fine notes...



(the Mrs is the Gammar police, I'm the Gramper police)



--

Neil MCNGP#30



- You're schizophrenic? Gee, that makes four of us!

-

"Kline Sphere" wrote:



I have to disagree with that. Everyone I've ever spoken with who has used

Transcender test preps has said that they're able to learn a significant

amount from the explanations. No memorization of the answers is required if

the test prep clearly explains why an answer is correct and another is not,

which Transcender does quite nicely. Memorization of the rules & reasons IE:

"GPOs can only be tied to Domains, OUs, & Sites" can actually give one an

excellent understanding of the subject matter.



I'm sure there have got to be some people in the world foolish enough to go

thru a Transcender test prep and attempt to memorize the answers, but I

hardly think that the majority of Transcender customers do so.

-

JaR <jrderby@lakabux.com>prattled ceaslessly in



Lions and Tigers and Bares, Oh My! <eg>



--

Catwalker

aka Pu$$y Feet

BS, MCP, MCSA, MCSE

MCNGP #43

www.mcngp.com

faq.mcngp.com

"Definitely not wearing any underwear."

-

Kline Sphere wrote:

I thought Google was my friend.

-

That's right Neil, real world decisions are always based on 'choosing

the best answer from the list above'. Your example above, shows just

why such exam questions are pointless, i.e why would a company use

(or would not use) 'Windows DNS'......, the only correct answer here

(given the lack of information) is 'who knows?'.



The exam topics do indeed cover a 'broad spectrum' of real world

problems (as defined in the prep guids), but they do not prove by

answering the question correctly, either in the real exams or

transcenders (and like of), that the person actual understands said

question. When someone can explain and describe why there choose the

answer, then the truly understand the question.



'prep' in the context of transcender and the like of, yes I sure am. I

don't blame the company, it's format that's crap; but soon........



only if you can 'read' in braille.



Kline Sphere (Chalk) MCNGP #3

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you know exactly what I mean, but incase you've forgotten :-



Being able to answer a question by memorizing the answer to a

predicted question does not constitute an understanding of the

question, and indeed, the answer.



Kline Sphere (Chalk) MCNGP #3

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"Jalexander01" <Jalexander01@discussions.microsoft.com>wrote in message

So, what have you been up to latley since Seinfeld, other than those silly

Chrystler commercials?





-

I'm sure people do. However, there are also people that use such

products simply because the questions and answers are so close to the

real thing; given the format it's hard for the answers not to be.



The question should not be about reciting a simple rule as in your

example given above. Being able the describe and explain why a GPO

would be more appropriate being 'tied' (as you put it) to an ou rather

than a domain for a given situation, without having to choose from a

list, would prove such understanding.



I truly have no idea. What I do know, is there are plenty of so called

'microsoft certified professionals' out there who know nothing about

what they are supposed to be 'certified' in. How do they do this?

Simple, they memorize the answers to the questions obtained from dumps

and/or from 'practice tests'.



Kline Sphere (Chalk) MCNGP #3

-

did you hear Kline Sphere <.@>say in



agreed, and agreed



(OMG!?!?!111!!!1!one!!!)



--

Neil MCNGP#30



- If you only have a nail every tool looks like a hammer.

-

did you hear Kline Sphere <.@>say in



happens every day at fast food restaraunts...conicidence?



--

Neil MCNGP#30



- Only a few fries short of a Happy Meal...

-

In microsoft.public.cert.exam.mcse, Ogre spewed across the ether:



Well, now you have two friends.



--

JaR

Thug 10110

MCNGP.com

-

did you hear Kline Sphere <.@>say in



yet happens every day. My kids learned multiplation by route first and

then slowly as they began to comprehend, the light goes on and they can

then get past 12 times 12.



Occasionally comprehension is derived from route. I will agree that it is

better to have the comprehension first. Learning however is unique to

each individual. Some people actauly learn from lecture. some from

reading, some from labs, some from watchnig videos....



--

Neil MCNGP#30



- Who is General Failure and why is he reading my drive?

-

did you hear Kline Sphere <.@>say in



I will agree with the "dumps"portion of that, but not the practice tests.



--

Neil MCNGP#30



- Life is sexually transmitted, and terminal...

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"Kline Sphere" wrote:







I don't disagree that there are plenty of people out there who are certified

yet not competent. I like to refer to this as "Big hat, no cattle".



Your issue seems to be more with the fact that the tests don't truly prove

an understanding of the material, and I agree with that. However, your

implication that a pratice test is no better a learning tool than a dump is

simply unfounded. Memorizing answers from a dump in no way compares to the

knowledge that can be gleaned from a well developed pratice exam. Niether

can compare to real world experience, but one is without a doubt a better

learning tool than the other.





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Up to a certain point, or rather grade, this is how we learn..... a

certain point that is.



Kline Sphere (Chalk) MCNGP #3

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